Client Service Agreements: Legal Must-Haves and Missteps with Leah Weinberg

Kevin Dennis (: 00:00

Alright, welcome to another episode of mind your wedding business. I have the one and only Leah Weinberg here with me today. Leah, how are doing? Good, me too. I'm excited to have you so alright Leah before we jump into the topic today, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and how we got you here today?

Leah (: 00:07

I'm good, excited to be here.

d then as of the beginning of: 2023

Kevin Dennis (: 00:24

You

So you please the parents and then you decided to be creative and then now we're now we're back now we're back being an adult or whatever you want to say. That's funny. All right. So we're here today. We have Leah here to talk about client service agreements and the legal must haves and missteps. So I guess as we jump in, what are like what are the non-negotiable? Sorry, I messed up.

Leah (: 00:51

Yes, yes, exactly.

Kevin Dennis (: 01:13

But what are the non-negotiables when it comes to client service agreements?

Leah (: 01:18

The first thing I want to address because this is becoming a question that I'm getting every time I speak and it's a big picture question and it has to do with should I use chat GPT to draft my contract.

Kevin Dennis (: 01:31

⁓ I never even thought of that. I would never. Okay.

Leah (: 01:34

Yes,

also you should never. It is not a good idea. I have seen contracts drafted by chat GPT. So I just want folks to like, let's not let's just not even go down that rabbit hole for purposes of this conversation. Every every it's coming up every time that I've spoken in like the last six months as what do you think about using chat GPT to draft my contract?

Kevin Dennis (: 01:50

And you get asked that a lot when you speak. mean, like...

Well, Chad GBT is not a lawyer and doesn't know that for the state, I'm sure everything's different by this state and could be even the county you're in, all kinds of stuff.

Leah (: 02:05

⁓

Yes, one of many reasons and chat GPT makes stuff up and uses site sources that don't even exist for things. So yeah, please don't trust chat GPT for legal purposes. Non-negotiables. So we want really clear scope of services.

Kevin Dennis (: 02:19

All right. I love that. We should have started with that, with a disclaimer. All right. So and then non-negotiables.

Okay.

Leah (: 02:35

One of the pain points I hear from a lot of different wedding and event professionals, every vendor category is clients pushing boundaries, blurring the lines, always asking them to do things that are above and beyond what is in their job description. And I get it, we're in the hospitality industry. A lot of us are people pleasers, recovering people pleasers, and we just wanna make people happy at the end of the day.

But that scope of services is what you're going to fall back on when you've got a client who's trying to push those boundaries and get more work out of you than you should be doing. So I'm a big fan of making sure that is really crystal clear what you are doing for your clients.

Kevin Dennis (: 03:15

Now, do you think that one is generation of clients that we're working for now? And I think that generation just pushes the boundaries. You know, I just because it I felt like in the last maybe two, three years, that's been a big shift in the wedding industry. Like they're really pushing the boundaries, you know, and it's not like one or two clients. It's all of them. So I really like that you put that in there. But also like.

Do you think like newer then like I'm newer to the wedding industry I'm gonna give give give more compared to an old you know is that part of it too or?

Leah (: 03:51

I don't think I don't necessarily think it is. mean, I think it's being clear. It's about doing your job really well. And I think when you do your job really well, it's going to feel like a going above and beyond thing. ⁓ But I don't think you really need I don't think you need to be doing stuff that's going to cost you your time and your energy and your mental well being because that is a quick path to burnout. think if you are no matter how

Kevin Dennis (: 03:52

Okay. Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Leah (: 04:19

new or seasoned you are, the more you're giving without being compensated, the faster we're going to hit burnout at some point.

Kevin Dennis (: 04:27

Gotcha. Now, did COVID, coming out of COVID change contract? You're laughing, but so I'm assuming yes, but it's like, did, I mean, I felt like our contract, thank God was ironclad and we were very successful with our, like we didn't get hit bad during COVID, but like so many wedding professionals did. So I mean.

Leah (: 04:49

Yeah.

Yeah. The reason I was laughing was because COVID is what ended my wedding planning career and like people more so just like how people started, how humans emerged from COVID and were not necessarily on their best behavior. And I just really couldn't handle that anymore. But to your point about the contract piece. So those force majeure rescheduling cancellation provisions, those are

Kevin Dennis (: 04:54

no way. Okay.

Leah (: 05:16

Critical and you would be surprised or maybe not so surprised that people still have really not Well drafted force majeure rescheduling and cancellation provisions. They've all got to work together I want them to be protective of you as a vendor There's a lot of responsibility that comes along with hosting a wedding hosting an event and I don't know that our clients

appreciate that and so we're using our contracts to really like allocate this risk and so you as a wedding professional you're counting on this money you've been counting on this money for a year for 18 months if a client decides to cancel if they decide to reschedule Why are you bearing the financial burden of that at a certain point, especially when the clients can get insurance? That's my big thing,

Kevin Dennis (: 05:43

Hmm.

Yeah, and a lot of them don't. So yeah.

Leah (: 06:09

I know, and it's the

best investment that they could make, frankly. It really isn't, yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 06:14

And it's really not that expensive either. yeah,

yeah. All right. So what are some vendor specific add-ons that someone should consider when putting together their agreement?

Leah (: 06:25

When it comes to photographers, one of the things I see a lot are disputes over, frankly, the aesthetics of the images. So clients come, well, I don't think it's genuine, but I think it's really easy for somebody, a couple to be like, hey, we don't like our photos, we want our money back, because it's so subjective. How are we really going to prove that? So for my photographers,

Kevin Dennis (: 06:32

Really?

Okay, all right.

Mmmmm.

Leah (: 06:50

I really want language in there that talks about artistic license and how this is a subjective service and dissatisfaction with aesthetics isn't grounds for getting any money back under the contract. ⁓ I think of my florists who are being very impacted by tariffs and rising costs right now. So for them in particular, and any other vendor that has a like very product-based, product-focused service business,

Kevin Dennis (: 07:04

Mmm.

Leah (: 07:18

You've got to have protections in there for cost increases, things like that. For my planners, my specialty provision currently is around the budget and what a planner's responsibility is when it comes to a client's budget, because clients are overspending and then trying to come back to the planner after the fact and say that it's the planner's fault that they went over their budget.

Kevin Dennis (: 07:45

Well, it is funny to use the over the budget. That's the biggest theme I'm hearing in the last several months is like we're over the budget. We need a cut. And it's like, I'm sorry because we're in we're an inventory based company. So you cannot we tell everyone clear and it's in our contract or at least I think it is in our contract that they can always add to their contract. They can't subtract. And so therefore, you know, so it's like, well, I'm sorry, you're you we've been holding this equipment for you. It belongs to you on that day of your wedding.

Leah (: 08:05

right.

Kevin Dennis (: 08:14

You know, it is what it is. You take it or leave it. But then with that said, a lot of them come back and even add more things to it, even though they, they, they, they, they come out saying they were over budget and then they're not really, it's so frustrating right now.

Leah (: 08:15

Right.

Yeah, it's tough. The money piece is all, I mean, the money piece has always been like the emotional hot button for everybody. And so, yeah, that's gonna always be one of the hardest pieces to this puzzle.

Kevin Dennis (: 08:39

Yeah, and sometimes too, think it's like the couples are counting on like a parent or someone to, you know, come through with X amount of dollars and later they're coming through with Y and then that changes a whole new stress because they were planning something that they don't no longer have the money for. anyway. All right. So what are some of the biggest pitfalls, mistakes you see wedding vendors make in their agreements?

Leah (: 08:44

Mmm.

Yep, absolutely.

Not frankly, not either working with an attorney on their contract or not letting chat GBT do it. We already answered that question. And like, and or, know, or not using an attorney drafted template. I, I call it Frankensteining contracts together where people maybe they start with a contract that their colleague uses, and then they're copying and pasting things from Google. And then they're getting provisions from people and Facebook groups. They're

Kevin Dennis (: 09:09

Letting ChatGBT do it? ⁓

Leah (: 09:34

getting stuff from chat GPT and you just really have this like hot podge mishmash of contract provisions. And unless you are a lawyer or good at legal drafting, I can promise you, you're going to have stuff in there that conflicts with each other. You're going to have provisions that might be ambiguous. You're going to have things that aren't enforceable in your state in particular. Yeah. So

Kevin Dennis (: 10:01

Hello?

Leah (: 10:03

Here's my perfect example. Let's say you're trying to, and this is, we won't get into the substance of this conversation, because I know people have strong feelings, but the idea of passing along credit card fees to a client. So yeah, we're not gonna talk about the merits of that or not, but if you wanna put that in your contract, you, let's say you're like, I wanna put this in my contract. Hey friend in this other state, how do I, what language do you use?

Kevin Dennis (: 10:15

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

Leah (: 10:30

And so let's say you've got somebody, you're in New York, you have a friend in New Jersey, you get language from your New Jersey friend and it says, you know, if client pays by credit card, that will incur a 3 % processing fee. That's fine to do in New Jersey. That is not fine to do in New York. And not many people realize that. So like, for example, in New York, the way it has to be worded is your fee, your stated fee is the maximum price.

Kevin Dennis (: 10:49

Hello.

Leah (: 10:58

and somebody can receive a discount if they pay with a cash or check. But you can't phrase it as your credit card charge will incur a 3 % fee. It has to be like phrased as a discount instead.

Kevin Dennis (: 11:14

And I like how you phrase that you get a discount because then it's like this is what it costs and then you're not adding the disk Yeah, that's a that's good way of doing it

Leah (: 11:22

Yeah, but

it's really like for New York, it's really about pricing transparency. So consumer laws want the consumer to know the maximum amount that they can pay and then they can get rewarded if they pay this other way. But yeah, if you were just taking that language from your friend's contract, who's a photographer in New Jersey, that's not gonna be enforceable in New York and could get you into trouble too.

Kevin Dennis (: 11:26

Yeah.

Well, yeah. All right. Long ago when I was with the president, we had an attorney come and speak to the group. And at the time my contract was like maybe a page and a half, two pages. And we, I realized I sent it over and had it reviewed and now it's seven pages and I was missing a lot of things. So, so with that said, how often should someone review update their service agreement, you know, and

Leah (: 12:02

Great. Yes.

Kevin Dennis (: 12:13

how often I'm imagining it's like a tune up or something, right? Okay.

Leah (: 12:18

Yeah, yeah. mean,

if you've never worked with an attorney on your contract, you need to just fix that and budget for it, find the right person to work with to get yourself in good shape now. And then I typically recommend taking a look at it about once a year, around that same time that maybe you're doing budgets for the year, putting your taxes together, doing goal setting, like that sort of downtime where you're kind of focused on the business. Take a look back at your contract.

Kevin Dennis (: 12:25

Hmm.

Leah (: 12:47

read through it, make sure, number one, make sure you still understand everything that's in there. Think about things that happened over the course of the year. If there are things you never wanna have happen again and you wanna add those to the agreement, like that's a perfect thing to think through. What were some of your pain points? Just kind of make sure you're taking some time out to have a thoughtful, take a thoughtful moment to be like, okay, this is what was going on in my business. These are the things I wanna prevent.

Kevin Dennis (: 12:52

Yeah.

Leah (: 13:16

Can I use my contract to prevent them? And then how do we get those updates in?

Kevin Dennis (: 13:21

So lots of questions, sorry, that came to my mind while you were doing that. it's just, so I guess if I had a situation that happened throughout the year, I want to add something to my contract. It's probably best to go to a lawyer, right? I mean, not try to add it in there myself. ⁓ Okay, all right, fair enough.

Leah (: 13:39

It really depends on what it is. if it's,

yeah, if it's something simple, like I always used an example of when I was planning, had a very early wedding where the couple didn't have a DJ. And so I got stuck having to cue the music for the ceremony. So you don't need, so if you don't ever want to do that, I don't think you need to go to a lawyer because you really can just put one sentence in there that says if the...

Kevin Dennis (: 13:56

Yeah.

Leah (: 14:06

client doesn't hire a band or a DJ, they will appoint a guest to be responsible for cueing the music and making announcements. Like the planner won't do those things. It can be that simple. But if it's more along the lines of my force majeure and rescheduling and cancellation policy, like something happened and I realized that those provisions do not work the way that I thought they did or the way that I want them to, that's something to go to an attorney for.

Kevin Dennis (: 14:15

Mmm.

Leah (: 14:34

So, and also frankly, when in doubt, just ask, like, I always say have a relationship with an attorney before you need one. So hopefully in those situations, if you do have an attorney who you have worked with before or who you've just established a relationship with, you can go to them and say, hey, I need to add something like this to my contract. Can I do this myself or is this something I should hire you to do?

Kevin Dennis (: 14:34

Mmm.

Hmm now, okay something that popped up is destination weddings. So like, you know, like we were together in Mexico You know for the bsage conference like I'm planning a wedding in Mexico. Does that change my contract? ⁓ Okay

Leah (: 15:05

Mm-hmm.

It does not.

No, so your contract should always be, so we call it governing law. So every contract is gonna have a governing law provision that says these are the laws of the state that govern my contract. And that should always be the state either where your business was formed or where you're currently operating out of. And I say that because I know some businesses might be formed and Delaware is a popular just state for.

Kevin Dennis (: 15:29

Mmm.

Leah (: 15:43

businesses to be formed, but most people aren't living in Delaware. So if you live in California, your entity was formed in Delaware, California law should always govern your contract. If you formed your entity in New York, you live in New York, New York law should always govern your contract no matter where the event takes place.

Kevin Dennis (: 15:54

Okay.

So like if I was trying to get away from that 3 % fee, I can't go over the bridge and set up this in New Jersey and then do work in in the city. Right. I mean, it just.

Leah (: 16:14

I mean, it depends, you can, but yeah. But for purposes of to simplify your question of like, based on where the event is happening, if we're doing destination events, like even if you, but even if you live in, even if your business is in New York and you're doing a California wedding, still that New York law should go.

Kevin Dennis (: 16:16

Okay.

Okay.

Well, and I would imagine if you are doing destiny, you probably have to have other provisions in there for like travel and other all kinds, all kinds of big stuff in there that probably again, you should probably hire an attorney to help you set up your contract to be strong with that. So, all right. We were talking about template did agreements. So is that I'm assuming we shouldn't be doing template it agreements. Okay.

Leah (: 16:39

yeah, true.

Yes.

They're a good place to start. if

you are not in a place where you can afford to have an attorney draft a custom contract for you, a template is a good place to start. Not all templates are created equal. So I suggest kind of asking around to see who has used what company. Honestly, even frankly ask it like if you, again, if you have a relationship with an attorney and that attorney can

Kevin Dennis (: 17:21

Mmm.

Leah (: 17:28

probably point you in the right direction of like, okay, I know you can't hire me, but here are the template shops that I've seen their templates, they're good, or I can vouch for them or something like that. Because yeah, they're not all created equal.

Kevin Dennis (: 17:39

Mm.

And yeah, and again, it probably comes down back to your state and all that kind of stuff. It changes a lot of that.

Leah (: 17:49

Yeah, yeah,

templates are tricky because templates are not going to be state specific. So that's the other catch that you always have is when you do purchase one of these templates, they are always coming with a disclaimer that says this is not tailored for any particular state and you should always take it to an attorney in your state to make sure that it complies with law. like, frankly, technically, even a template is telling you to go hire an attorney in your own state, which...

Kevin Dennis (: 17:54

Mmm.

Leah (: 18:16

Most people are not, let's be honest, but you should. And so that's kind of why it's like you're still paying money to get something that's still not quite perfect. So if you have the budget to spend just a little bit more and get something tailored for your business. also, one of the reasons, you know, I'm a big proponent of one-on-one legal services is even if you get a template, a well-drafted template, you probably aren't going to have an opportunity to sit down with the attorney who drafted that.

Kevin Dennis (: 18:19

Yeah.

Leah (: 18:46

to have them explain what everything means. And that's a thing that I care about very deeply as I want all of my clients to understand their contracts. Because when their clients have questions or if their clients have comments, I want them to feel confident in being able to answer the majority of those questions. Obviously, you're not gonna be able to expound on like what indemnity means probably and have like a really.

Kevin Dennis (: 18:54

Mmm.

Leah (: 19:12

nuanced conversation about that, but I want you to be able to answer a lot of questions. I want you to understand your contract. So as part of my process, it's always we do the updates to your contract and then we have a call where we're going through that thing from top to bottom so that I can explain what everything means. And so when you have a template, you're, also missing out on that opportunity as well.

Kevin Dennis (: 19:29

Hmm.

Well that and then like you were saying, it's nice to have a one on one, you know, cause when, when questions do come up, it's probably nice to be able to like shoot Leah an email and like, Hey, can you help to talk me through this one little incident, whatever. So, all right.

Leah (: 19:44

Exactly.

Yes, and I get

those emails daily. So yeah, but that's part of like, I mean, that's part of, yeah, that's part of the relationship. That's why I tell people like, have a relationship with an attorney because I'm not billing people for ⁓ a five minute response to an email. I'd rather have you get it right. Always come back to me so that we can get it right than you worrying about like small, getting invoices for like small increments of time.

Kevin Dennis (: 19:50

Do you really? God, I can only imagine. The job, yeah.

All right. So I know we're a wedding podcast, but many of us work in the corporate America and ⁓ world. so a lot of times very sometimes we'll get wedding clients that want to remove or add something to our contract. Usually they're attorneys. I'll be honest with you. And so, yeah. And so then ⁓ or the dad's an attorney or, somewhere along the line. I always get shocked when they're an attorney and they don't want to add or remove something from our contract. I'm always like, ⁓ okay, maybe it's.

Leah (: 20:31

Of course.

Kevin Dennis (: 20:42

Better than I thought. ⁓ with corporate America, they want a line item and go through our contract like crazy. So how should someone handle removing, changing, altering any of the above of the contract?

Leah (: 20:57

Yeah, when it's that significant, you've got to get an attorney involved, especially when it's a corporate client on the other side. I mean, it always really depends on the size of the job as to how much you're investing in it. But if it's a significant size job, it is worth working with an attorney to like, to really review those changes, because there's a lot of stuff and I've seen people do it. They've agreed they agreed to stuff before they brought it to me. And then I'm like,

you never should have agreed to that. ⁓ So yeah, and you've got to understand too, like a corporate client's probably got in-house counsel, they're going to be more sophisticated. And so they're probably making comments that are much more complicated or legal based than what your wedding couple might be making. So it's always important.

Kevin Dennis (: 21:36

They do, yeah, yeah.

Leah (: 21:49

⁓ one of the questions since we're on the corporate topic that I get asked is what happens when a corporate client wants me to sign their contract rather than negotiating yours. And I always say that it depends. It all comes down to who has the leverage. If you are doing an event with the Google or you're doing an event with Disney, your Apple, you're using their caught. Like you are using their contract. There really is no way around that. And.

Kevin Dennis (: 22:00

⁓

Apple.

Yeah.

Leah (: 22:19

to some extent, like the conversations I'll have with my client is like, hey, this contract is really one sided to them. They're not giving us X, Y, and Z. You just have to make the decision of, it worth me taking on this risk for purposes of getting this job and like getting in with this company? And sometimes the client's like, yeah, it is. So it's always just a conversation. You know, I'm never gonna tell somebody not to do something. I just tell them,

Kevin Dennis (: 22:43

No. Yeah.

Leah (: 22:45

here's the risk that you're taking and you get to make that choice of whether it's worth it to you to take it on or not.

Kevin Dennis (: 22:53

That makes sense. Yeah, I know. And it's always scary because again, you do a whole series on legalese and all the different letters and what all the different things mean. Because, you know, I don't understand half of them. And I think I learned more about contracts going through COVID than I did. Or even looking at our contracts, you know, when we went through COVID than I did before, you know. So, yeah, no, it's all that kind of stuff. So, all right. So.

We do at our company, we do addendums. So when the client wants to change things, so talks us through addendums.

Leah (: 23:24

Mm.

Yeah, like addendums amendments are for when there's something changing about this, like the scope of services, they're adding something on the price of something is changing. The question about amendments and addendums has come up recently with regard to the tariffs and the cost increases and stuff, because people are saying they're saying, hey, well, my contract doesn't protect me. Can I now add an addendum that does protect me?

Kevin Dennis (: 23:50

⁓ yes.

Leah (: 23:59

And I always say your client has no obligation to sign anything new like that. And I think it's something I don't necessarily recommend because I think you're changing the business deal in the middle of the process. Yeah. like if somebody's adding additional rentals or somebody's adding more time for a photographer or adding more DJ time or like they want a planner to now plan a rehearsal dinner, like all of that stuff is things, okay, we're agreeing to that.

Kevin Dennis (: 24:12

The deal, yeah, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Leah (: 24:28

there's an extra fee associated with that, an amendment and addendum is appropriate in that situation. But when you as a vendor go, uh-oh, I'm not protected from the rising costs of these materials and labor, I want to make sure I'm protected. I don't think that it's the right strategy to try to add that to your contract because like a contract is a contract and there's no reason, there's no consideration for your clients to sign something new like that.

Kevin Dennis (: 24:57

Well, and it's like it's like the cost of doing business. You you unfortunately didn't make a good deal and it's not in your favor because I was recently listening to a podcast and they were kind of talking about all the tariffs and all the things going on in the world. And someone went, you know, like people are like exactly what you were what you were coming up with, like trying to go out there and change it on the fly. But the person brought up an extremely good point that I thought was a good counterpoint is like.

Okay. So you get a discount like beef got reduced. You know, I'm a caterer beef instead of being $20 a pound is now 15. Are you going to go back and give your, ⁓ you know, your, customers a discount? No, you, you, you want on that one, you lose on this one and it's a price to do in business. So I think, yeah. So, all right. Where,

Getting kind of to the end here. So what are like I guess we kind of went through the mistakes But what are we missing like what what have we not talked about because I think I think we went through it But I feel like you know, you're the attorney you're the expert

Leah (: 26:01

Yeah, I mean, when

it comes to your client service agreements, I think, well, I think I want to just kind of back up and like just give big picture idea here and why they're so important. So your client service agreement, it's one of the building blocks of your business. So I always say like, just like having an entity for your business, having an EIN, having insurance, having your personal and business finances separate, your client service agreement should be viewed as like one of those.

Kevin Dennis (: 26:11

Okay.

Leah (: 26:27

foundational elements, one of the things you've got to invest in when you start a business. And then number two, it is the foundation of the relationship with your clients because it outlines everything. It's got the event details, it's got who's doing what, what everybody's responsibilities are. Most importantly, it talks about what happens when things go wrong. So that way we're not left wondering. And so it governs the relationship with your client. And then the third reason it's so important is because it's how we try to prevent a lot of these like

Kevin Dennis (: 26:32

Hmm.

you

Leah (: 26:57

post-wedding disputes from the beginning. We try to address things upfront, set expectations, have clear boundaries, have really clear rules for rules of engagement for this whole process so that, again, when something goes wrong or somebody's not happy, we've kind of already tried to take care of that with the contract to begin with. So your contracts really are so fundamental to your business.

Kevin Dennis (: 27:19

Hmm.

Leah (: 27:23

And I just want folks to make sure that they are investing that time and money and having something that's really strong, well drafted, protective of their business. Cause when you think about it, the second you've got an updated client service agreement, every new client signs that, but every new client and whoever comes after signs that better version. So it is like worth the investment today right now, because everything that comes after is going to leave you more protected.

Kevin Dennis (: 27:45

Mm-hmm.

Love it. Alright, I'm in California, you're in New York. Does that mean I can hire you even though you're in New York or how does that work?

Leah (: 28:01

I have a California attorney, my firm serves a handful of states. We're currently covering New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Georgia, Florida, Illinois, Texas, and California.

Kevin Dennis (: 28:03

OK.

All right, perfect. Yeah, because I know that you have to be very specific to the state. So all right. I love it. I mean, it's boring, but we love it. I mean, it's no, I mean, but I think it's it's scared in a good way because I don't think there is so many vendors. I mean, I was the Whippa president, the national Whippa president when COVID hit. And so I just heard a horror story.

Leah (: 28:17

Yes. Yeah.

Yeah

Hopefully I haven't scared everybody. usually have that impact on people. They're like, ⁓

Kevin Dennis (: 28:43

after horror story of people that just didn't have their house and everything in order. And so when, you know, the world changed forever, they weren't prepared or ready to go for it. So I think it's, it's almost like you got to think of it as insurance or think of it as that you're there to protect what you built. You know, people work so hard to build their businesses and you know, like one bad misstep could take the whole thing down. So it's, yeah, it's definitely worth it.

To have it all ready to come so. Alright, so we heard about all the states you work in, but how how do we get a hold of you and how do we ⁓ hire Leah to work with us if we're in those states?

Leah (: 29:14

Absolutely.

Yes, so my website is Weinberglegal.com. I'm also on Instagram at the Leah Weinberg and Weinberglegal. My emails on the website. There's also a contact form where folks can submit and I should also mention if anybody needs trademark stuff that actually is not state specific. So if you're a business anywhere in the country that wants to look into getting a trademark for your business name, that is something that my firm can help with as well.

Kevin Dennis (: 29:49

Is that something everyone should do? didn't know. Or is that a whole another podcast? Like, mind blown right there. I know, Leah with a mic drop at the end. So, all right, perfect. All right, so we'll have all of Leah's information in the show notes and help you guys get a hold of her.

Leah (: 29:51

Depend. It depends. ⁓ that might be that might be a whole half of a podcast. Yeah.

Like, let's open up that can of worms right at the end.

Kevin Dennis (: 30:13

Also, if you don't follow her on Instagram, I really recommend that you do because the legal ease, she does the really good series called legal ease and she just basically teaches us dumb, dumb creatives. what, what these terms mean sometimes you, know, you hear these terms all the time and you just really don't know the definition of them and you may not care about the definition of them, but you really probably should care about the definition of them because if you're in business, you probably should care about the whole enchilada and not just the one little creative piece. So, all right.

Leah (: 30:42

Yes.

Kevin Dennis (: 30:43

So Leah, thank you. The audience is going to thank you so much. I'm imagining you're going to get lots of calls because people are going to want to get their house in order and get everything fixed. you know, it just it's it. We did it. And now that you're talking, I'm like, maybe we should have our contract looked at again because it's been a while. I mean, it was pre-COVID the last time we had our contract looked at. So no, no, we really can't. So. All right, Leah, thank you so much. I really appreciate your time.

Leah (: 31:04

Yeah, can't hurt. So, yep. Yeah, thanks for having

me.

Kevin Dennis (: 31:12

Yep, alright, we'll talk to you soon. Thanks everyone.