Clients and Social Media: How to Respond with Brandee Gaar

Kevin Dennis (: 00:39

Alright folks, welcome to another episode of Mind Your Wedding Business. I'm with Brandee Gaar, the CEO of the Wedding Pro CEO. So, Brandee, welcome.

Brandee Gaar (: 00:48

Thank you so much

for having me. I'm so excited about this conversation today.

Kevin Dennis (: 00:52

I

am too, because I watched all the little videos that I needed to do for homework before and I don't ever really do ever homework. this is I consider it a first. Yeah, I was like, I was had very strict instructions I needed to do homework before. But anyway, we're going to be talking about clients and social media and how to respond to some crazy things. And you have great experience in this as well. But Brandee, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and how we got you here today?

Brandee Gaar (: 01:02

feel honored, I love it, thank you.

Yes, yes. So my name is Brandee Gaar, like Kevin said, and I have I am a wedding planner in Orlando, Florida. I've built one of the largest planning firms here in Orlando. And about five years ago, I started coaching. during the pandemic, I had so there were so many other companies in our area, right? Everybody was just kind of like, how are you navigating this? What are you doing? And I really had the blessing of

Kevin Dennis (: 01:36

Mmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 01:46

having been in the industry at that point for you know, over a decade, I had a really strong, ⁓ you know, community that I could ask questions to as well. I also had a large team that I could lean on. And I noticed that there were a lot of solo business owners who were just like, honestly, it was such a hard time, especially if you are solo, because it was like, where do you turn? Who can you ask questions to? Who can you trust? What? What's everybody doing? And so I literally just started going live every morning. I was not a coach at the time yet. I just thought

Kevin Dennis (: 02:03

Mmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 02:16

let me just go live on Facebook every morning. I'm going to start just talking about one thing that we had to deal with the day before or one thing that we're learning one thing we're handling. And I kind of then just kept going, you know, I'm in Florida, and we reopened in June of that year. So we were able to get back to normal business fairly quickly, but people were starting to show up to the lives. And so I kept going through October and then ⁓ just really enjoyed that kind of live aspect of being able to connect with people. And then

Kevin Dennis (: 02:31

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 02:46

I jumped on the clubhouse train. ⁓ When clubhouse got popular. Yep, I loved clubhouse. And I went all in on clubhouse. It was like everybody was there, you know, December 2020. I remember my husband said, you know, you should try out this app. And I was like, I am not I don't need another thing on my plate right now. No, was December, you know, crazy season anyway. And so he went in and just secured my username. And he was like, you really should just

Kevin Dennis (: 02:48

Mm-hmm. I was gonna ask. I was gonna ask. Yeah

Brandee Gaar (: 03:13

jump in. And so I started kind of listening to how it worked. And I was like, I could almost do what I did on Facebook, but on here, and then I don't even have to like put on hair and makeup, right. So I started a daily show, it was at 10am every day. And we just had hundreds of people that would tune into this show. It was crazy. And we would have guests come up on stage and talk about different things. And so that was really kind of the catalyst to my coaching career was people then started reaching out and saying, How can I work with you? You know, do you have a coaching program and

Kevin Dennis (: 03:22

Mm-hmm. ⁓

Mmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 03:43

⁓ that was really what started wedding pro CEO was, I had a podcast and kind of has evolved from just my name to now wedding pro CEO. And we've built out, we are building out, ⁓ you know, an educational platform for wedding pros to learn how to grow and scale a profitable business. So we teach business education to wedding business owners. Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 04:03

I love it. That's what

we're all about here on the Mind Your Wedding Business podcast. Excited. All right. We're here to talk about clients, social media, and how to respond. I love that you left that side.

Brandee Gaar (: 04:08

Yeah.

Such a sad topic.

⁓ Because I'm just like, ⁓ this is so, it's every wedding vendors worst nightmare. know, it, yeah. But yeah, let's get into it.

Kevin Dennis (: 04:27

It is. I agree. So I mean,

all right, well, we used to be afraid of Yelp and Google reviews and all that. now the couples have the power of TikTok on their side. so we've seen an uptick in couples using social media to give their opinions on how to work with vendors, what went right and what went wrong with them, some positive, some negative. So what are some best practices when it comes to responding to a negative social media post?

Brandee Gaar (: 04:34

Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 04:55

Or should they even respond?

Brandee Gaar (: 04:56

Yeah.

Yeah. So I do definitely think that you should respond. mean, TikTok short form video has become the new Google review, right? Honestly, you know, and that's really, I guess what I want to say is that's really what I want you to think about it like, because a lot of us think either if you're not on TikTok, you don't think it's that big of a deal. And we're to talk about a certain case example, right? On the show of one that just recently happened.

Kevin Dennis (: 05:06

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 05:25

And that vendor was not on TikTok prior to this happening at all. She had no presence on TikTok. She never even opened the app. So she kind of got like a rude, you know, entry into the TikTok world. But you you don't actually realize that it can be a problem if you're not on that app. Now, all that to say when I say yes, you should respond. It's kind of exactly like we would handle a Google review, not WeddingWire Yelp. You should be responding to all of those reviews. And I really

Kevin Dennis (: 05:31

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 05:53

also think that we should be handling them with the same best practices. So some of those best practices would be one, make a public statement under the review, right? So make sure, and so I'm gonna, actually, Kevin, let me back up for a second. I want to talk about how we would do it if it was Yelp, Google, the not, and then let's see how we can apply that to how it would work on social media, right? So that we at least all get on the same page as what the best practices are. So.

Kevin Dennis (: 06:10

Okay, alright.

All right, perfect.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 06:18

best practices for handling, let's say written reviews would be one make a public statement, right? So you've got to respond to the review. If that client has not already given you an opportunity to handle it privately, and they honestly you didn't know that there was an issue, they just kind of went straight to the review. I think it would be really smart to reach out to them privately as well. But you want to get that public statement up. That's not defensive. That's honestly not even really playing out the case. It's just

Kevin Dennis (: 06:36

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 06:47

We are so sorry to hear this was your experience. If you have already talked to them, as we've discussed privately, this was not what we were looking for so that people know you have had a conversation with them. If you haven't already had a conversation ⁓ saying we would love to discuss this privately, we've reached out via email and we're excited to make this right for you. ⁓ Because the reality is reviews matter.

Kevin Dennis (: 06:57

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 07:14

they do matter. And so we want as much as possible to make a situation right before it ever gets to the review, or even if they've left a review, let's make it right and see if we can either get the review edited or taken down. Right? That's that's the best case scenario. So knowing that those are our best practices with written reviews, the same would really be true of social media reviews. And so what Kevin's referring to, if you don't already know if you're not on TikTok, if it's not something you've seen happen before, ⁓

Kevin Dennis (: 07:14

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 07:43

TikTok is very much ⁓ an interest-based algorithm. So that means anybody that they think would be interested in hearing that video, they're gonna push it out too. And so as a video picks up steam, more and more people see it, this is how something goes viral. So what happens is a lot of times now with Gen Z instead of leaving a Google review or in addition to leaving a Google review, they will go make a video review of

your performance or what they were upset about or what they're frustrated about or whatever. And it can go super viral and it can be really a challenge for your brand, right? It can it can really go either way. But for the most part, we've seen that it's not something any of us wish to happen. And so that's kind of the new review. And so the same best practices would apply here. You always want to make a public response so that

Kevin Dennis (: 08:14

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 08:39

You know, people see that you care. People see that you've tried in your public response. Same thing you would do on a written Google response. You want to not be defensive. You want to be clear about what has been done to try to mitigate the damage. You want to be factual, unemotional, which is really hard to do in video because you can't, you got, you got, I mean, you can keep retaking it, but for the most part, people want to see that emotion there, right? You also want to reach out to the client and see if there's anything that you can do to, to

Kevin Dennis (: 08:56

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 09:09

make it right because at end of the day, if that genuinely was their experience and you can make it right, let's make it right. Let's get the video taken down. Let's get the video edited, whatever that looks like. But the same basic principles apply. It's just that the unfortunate part is that because these videos can go viral and reach many more millions of people, it can really be a really big challenge for vendors to navigate.

Kevin Dennis (: 09:15

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

millions. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Alright, so can we dive into your client? Okay, tell us a little bit about her. Like, she was blindsided by the video, didn't know anything about it, found out from friends or another, or co-worker I guess it was that she found out about it. So I'll let you dive in and go, but because it was just watching all the videos I did, like I said, I did my homework and I was feeling for the girl, the makeup artist.

Brandee Gaar (: 09:40

Yeah. Yep.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah,

it was rough. So yes, so Kendra Jones, she's the owner of Twirly Shears, which is hair and makeup beauty company in California. And ⁓ she runs a small team there, really, really high touch, you know, standards. And she is not on TikTok at all, was not on TikTok at all, 0 % never had gone to Hunnit. And ⁓ a bride.

Kevin Dennis (: 10:08

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 10:31

that had had services done about six months prior. So this wasn't even recent necessarily, ⁓ had made a video about how she had washed off her makeup after Candra's team was actually Candra herself ⁓ did the makeup. And the challenge was that one, the bride never told her that she didn't like it, which thankfully she has proof of. ⁓

Kevin Dennis (: 10:39

Yeah!

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 10:59

And you know, do makeup artists especially do these little videos now with brides of like, do you love your makeup? Can I do a little video testimonial kind of a thing? So she she had that ⁓ she was there that day for hours after and never knew the bride had all of this going on behind the scenes. And so the bride made this video it went mega viral, tens of millions of people, tens of millions of people.

Kevin Dennis (: 11:08

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it said

20 something million on the video when I looked at it. Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 11:26

It's unreal. It's

unreal. And so, yes. So basically what you just said, she was doing ⁓ a private event and someone kind of reached out, another coworker and just was like, girl, you need to get on TikTok. And she's like, I've never been on TikTok. So this poor thing is just, this video is going mega viral. And one of the things that's interesting about TikTok too is it's like, it's not even just the brides video that's going viral. It's now.

the hundreds of creators that are making video responses to it that are going viral. And she doesn't even have a tick tock account. So she's like, what is happening? So she has to one learn how to even like navigate tick tock, see all of these videos, figure out who the bride is be like, wait a second. No, no, no, no, this was a flawless wedding, like what happened. And I think that was the the thing that really played into her favor. And this is the bride never told her

Kevin Dennis (: 12:00

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 12:21

she didn't like her makeup. And I think that's, that's ultimately why the internet sided with her. So spoiler alert, this one went in the bride's or sorry, in Kendra's favor. The internet strongly disagreed with the bride about how she handled it. In addition to that, you know, if it's your wedding day, and according to the bride, it was an hour before her ceremony that she's washing off this makeup. If if that's truly the case, the fact that you're stopping to keep make videos

Kevin Dennis (: 12:25

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 12:51

to keep making these videos along the way of like, I'm gonna wash off my makeup. ⁓ I'm gonna have to redo my makeup. Like if you're really in that much of a hurry and that much trauma from this, you're not stopping to make TikTok videos about it, you know? And then holding it for six months and putting it together at the right time.

Kevin Dennis (: 13:04

Yeah.

That's

the part I was trying to figure out the most. If you're really trying to go after the makeup artist, you would have released it the next day. That's the part I was like, why did we wait six months?

Brandee Gaar (: 13:13

Right.

Hello, Ray.

Right, and to Kendra's point, she was like, you know, why didn't she tell me on site? Like, I don't love it. Is there anything we can change? Like, that was never something that was said. She had no idea. Anything. There's so many better ways to handle this. And instead, the bride released the video. And you know, what happened in this case is that the bride said, well, I never tagged the makeup artist.

Kevin Dennis (: 13:27

Yeah.

Or even the week after, you know, like, yeah, yeah, I don't get.

Brandee Gaar (: 13:47

Well, right, but internet sleuths, it's not that difficult. She had tagged her in all of her wedding photos on her Instagram. So people figured out who it was very, very quickly and started, you know, doing all these support videos for Kendra. By the time she even got on TikTok, which was less than 24 hours later, she had, you know, so many people that wanted to know more about her. So the thing that I think is like ⁓ a textbook of how to handle this is Kendra.

took the emotion out of it. She waited, she gave herself overnight to sleep on it before she made the response video. And her response video was so calm, even though she was anything but, you know, she's like, I'm gonna lose my whole business over this, this is insane. She was so calm, so collected. She said no negative words against the bride at all. She was very factual and her video.

Kevin Dennis (: 14:24

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 14:43

also ended up going mega viral. And the internet, like I said, went in her direction. had, gosh, I wish I could remember exactly. So she, I want to say she had some multiple hundreds of inquiries.

Kevin Dennis (: 14:55

Yeah,

it was 120 or something within... Yeah, yeah, I just watched the videos. Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 14:58

Okay, thank you. Yes. Within like a week.

It was so crazy. And so the way I kind of found out about it was, you know, I was at a conference and so I'm in my hotel room at like 11pm and I'm scrolling and every other video is this crazy bride video and it's people responding to it. And I'm like, what on earth? And so then I all of a sudden I see twirly shears. I'm like, wait a second, hang on a second. No way.

Kevin Dennis (: 15:15

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 15:24

And then I see another one. I'm like, so I realized Kendra is in my program. So I immediately text her. I'm like, girl, what is happening in your world right now? She was like, I can't handle it. I'm freaking out. I don't know what to do. And so we quickly were like, let's get in recon mode, brought on a social media manager, brought on somebody to help kind of triage what was happening, brought on an assistant to help her with all the leads. ⁓ But the reality is she has had an incredible amount of

Kevin Dennis (: 15:29

Yeah.

thing.

Brandee Gaar (: 15:53

media coverage of inquiries, her business has grown significantly. ⁓ You know, she's she's just gained a lot of clout in the way that she's handled it. And so I would say and of course, the bride took the video down like the next day. ⁓ Yeah, she took the video down immediately and closed her account because people were it was to be honest, the internet can be awful, right? You. Right, because, like Kendra and I had a real honest conversation about it. It's like,

Kevin Dennis (: 16:07

Did she really?

yeah, it's the worst. It's a cesspool. Let's be real.

Brandee Gaar (: 16:23

Yeah, we didn't want her to be able to do that. And she was awful for doing that. But also, like people sending terrible messages to her, like, I hope you get divorced, you know, terrible things. And that that's not right, either. Right. And Kendra didn't go do that. So, you know, she immediately took the video down. She did reach out to Kendra directly. So, you know, I think for her, it backfired, unfortunately.

Kevin Dennis (: 16:34

you

No, no, I agree, I agree.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 16:51

But what I think is important for all of us to see is that Candra came out immediately because I would love to talk about one other situation that happened as well that kind of went a different direction. So do you remember the sepia bride commotion? Okay. Kevin. Okay. So this was maybe six months before Candra's incident. And this one, I would say went slightly different in that there was a bride.

Kevin Dennis (: 17:00

Yeah, let's do it. Yeah, yeah.

No, no I do not.

Okay.

Brandee Gaar (: 17:18

This was photography. So there was a bride that got her photos back and she did not like her photos and she posted them all over. Again, she said I never tagged the photographer because that's how they get away from slander. right. And so but the reality is, again, she was tagged on her Instagram. So everyone knew it was immediately. But she made probably 40 videos. I mean, just one after another of

Kevin Dennis (: 17:24

Hmm.

Linda, yeah.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 17:48

how much she hated her photos and how you know, they were all edited, it ended up becoming called like sepia gate because that's it. She said there was an orange filter on all of her photos. Well, it really divided the internet because a lot of people were on her side and we're like, your photos are awful, blah, blah. And a lot of people sided with the photographer because honestly, the photographer style is 100 % this type of photos she got back. So everybody was like, well, what do you think you were gonna get back if you

Kevin Dennis (: 17:50

Wow.

Hmm.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 18:17

picked a photographer who shoots that way who edits that way. And so but it really divided the internet. And one of the things that I think I never want to say a vendor handles something the wrong way. Because to be honest, we're all just navigating this life like what do I do? But she never came out and made a statement. And she really let it go on for weeks and weeks. She ended up doing one podcast that I'm aware of, which is a very well known podcast in the industry. So that was very smart of her. But it was

Kevin Dennis (: 18:20

Yeah.

Mmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 18:47

It was really one podcast that was geared more towards business owners. And so to me, I think one of the biggest things that makes these two cases different was that I think if she would have gone on and made a statement and kind of given her side without slandering the bride, I really think it could have gone a long way because everyone was guessing. Everyone was like, well, what did the contract say? And what did?

Kevin Dennis (: 18:51

Okay.

you

Brandee Gaar (: 19:13

you know, what did you see a full gallery like all of these things and I just think we needed her side. And I think it could have just mitigated it a lot more. The internet was literally 5050 on this whole situation. And I did a ton of videos about that as well on Hey, this is what you you should do as a vendor, you got to come out and make a statement. And, you know, I still very much run my planning business, I definitely get it. Like I don't want this to happen. You know, but the reality is

Kevin Dennis (: 19:40

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 19:43

It is the new way of leaving a review and we can't be afraid to step out and say, here's the other side, you know?

Kevin Dennis (: 19:45

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Well, and so when you're doing that, I feel like do you need to hire professional like so for these two people like if the photographer would have Reached out and got like a PR or a social media person to help them navigate the situation It probably would have been more successful like how your client reached out and got help Yeah

Brandee Gaar (: 20:00

Mm-hmm.

Yes. Yeah.

I mean, yes, I do think so. also think, you know, even just, just say something like not defensive, obviously, but a lot of times you have such limited time to get in front of it. It's like, who would you even reach out to? What PR company would you even reach out to? If you don't already have a business coach, what do you do? You don't have time. And so the reality is I think it's important to

Kevin Dennis (: 20:33

Mm-hmm.

That's true.

Brandee Gaar (: 20:41

I'm so glad that you're doing this podcast because for anybody that's listening, I think one of the things that I would encourage you to do is to go back and and watch Kendra's response. Maybe we can link it Kevin and in the show notes. Yeah, because I think it's helpful to just be able to say, you know, okay, I see how she handled it. Because a lot of times let's think about it. If you get a bad review on Google.

Kevin Dennis (: 20:50

Mm-hmm. yeah, I'm gonna for sure link it.

Brandee Gaar (: 21:04

you need help to try to write the response. And sometimes you might go to other people's negative reviews and see how they responded or whatever. It's a similar concept here. I want you to see how she responded and how you could do that too. Because often you have to react pretty quickly. I would say the number one thing is just not to be defensive, like do not be defensive. And then the second piece of it would be and I know that this is one of the reasons that the photographer and sepia gate did not want to reply was because there was some legal action that was teetering around in the background.

Kevin Dennis (: 21:21

Mm-hmm.

⁓

okay, fair enough.

Brandee Gaar (: 21:35

And so, right. And so I think that that was one of the reasons she was kind of like, I don't really want to respond publicly to this right away. And so I would say if there is legal action that's pending, or that you have in the background or a possibility of it, I would say to reach out to an attorney, we have several in the wedding industry that can, you know, pretty quickly get you help within 24 hours or so just to let you know, what can you say? Or, you know, legally, is there anything

Kevin Dennis (: 21:53

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 22:04

that the client has like here, you know, is if they do, then let's maybe hold off. But for the most part, they're usually venting about something that they're just not happy about. And it stinks. It's frustrating.

Kevin Dennis (: 22:16

So,

do they go to TikTok the most, do think? Okay, and instead of like Google or Instagram or any other...

Brandee Gaar (: 22:23

Yes. Yeah, it's TikTok. Yeah, I mean, you know,

I think some of them probably still go to do Google because they know that the Google reviews are still somewhat powerful. But the reality is Gen Z is not even using Google as a search engine anymore. They're using TikTok as a search engine. So TikTok is their Google. I'm not saying that they've never used Google before, of course, but they, TikTok is quickly replacing Google for them in all the ways.

Kevin Dennis (: 22:34

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 22:51

And so it just is their place where they think they can go and, you know, make these videos and say, here's what I'm feeling. Now, I will say, I've seen some couples that go on there and they are, they have a genuine frustration and they know if they take it to social media, it might get fixed. You know, like we even see this with big companies. I saw somebody the other day that was able to get Airbnb to give her a full refund because they screwed up and she couldn't get the refund through. ⁓

Kevin Dennis (: 22:51

Mmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 23:20

their customer service. So she went to TikTok, it went viral and Airbnb reached out and made it right. And then she made a video about how they made it right. And so, you know, I've seen couples that have gone on there and said something like, you know, my photos were supposed to be delivered within 12 weeks. It's now been six months since our wedding. Our photographers ghosted us. We've heard nothing. I do think, I think there's value in being able to use social media that way. I don't know that I would say I would do it, but.

Kevin Dennis (: 23:40

Hmm.

Mm-hmm.

No.

Brandee Gaar (: 23:50

It's a way to get somebody to respond because they're

Kevin Dennis (: 23:50

But... Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 23:52

not responding. But if you're going on there to slash a wedding vendor just simply because you didn't really like what you got. I don't really agree with that. I don't think it's the right thing to do. I do think everyone is well within their rights to write a review. That's what they're there for. But I don't think couples understand how viral and how devastating it can be for a business to give half the information and then have it go to millions of people.

Kevin Dennis (: 24:18

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, because then you're not telling your whole story. You know, they're not hearing the whole thing. And then that's when it all gets made up.

Brandee Gaar (: 24:25

Yeah, and

that's when it all gets made up because the court of public opinion joins in. And one of the things I saw happen, not with either of these two cases, but with another one that was slightly less viral. ⁓ But I saw one of them where a lot of just the viewers of this video were going then on Google and writing negative reviews about this company. And so now they're getting flooded with one star reviews from people who've

Kevin Dennis (: 24:31

Mm-hmm.

⁓ yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 24:55

they've never even heard of. And now I will say those can be disputed through Google. So if something like that happens, those can be disputed. And I will say I think Google has gotten a lot better because of all of this. I Google's gotten a lot better about saying, Yep, if they can't prove that they worked with you, then they'll kick the review out. But it's still I mean, mentally, it's, you know, you're exhausted, but you're also it's just mentally very draining.

Kevin Dennis (: 24:56

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, it's another crazy thing that we have to navigate now in the world of the wedding that just stresses us out. Because we have one shot to make this wedding perfect. And now we have this wonderful platform for the couples to go to. do you think there's a way, like, let's back up a lot and go to the booking process. Is there a way, do you think, to identify these folks before?

Brandee Gaar (: 25:33

That's right.

Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 25:50

You book with them or they book with you? Or... Okay.

Brandee Gaar (: 25:51

funny enough, my husband has asked that question so many times. He's

like, how can we weed out the crazy before they become a client? Right? ⁓ I don't think you always see them coming. I mean, in Kendra's case, you know, I think what probably hurt Kendra the most is that this bride and her connected on a more personal level as well, like during her trial and on the wedding day. So she was like, not only am I just hurt by the fact that she made this video and never told me she had an issue, but also like

Kevin Dennis (: 25:58

You're right. Yeah.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 26:21

We talked for hours at her trial. We shared a lot about just our faith journey, our personal. And so sometimes you do not see it coming. It just smacks you upside the head. Sometimes you do see it coming. I will say, if you know, if you see any kind of red flags, you know that there was maybe, right, red flag, ⁓ but if you see either a red flag or

Kevin Dennis (: 26:27

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

And I say red flags all the time. I'm like, red flag, red flag.

Brandee Gaar (: 26:51

or maybe you did have a service disruption, right? Like maybe you did make a mistake. We're all humans. Maybe something happened that you're like, dang it, I wish I could have done that better. Reach out to the client, try to mitigate it privately, try to handle it privately, make it right privately. You know, even if you didn't make a mistake, sometimes their perception is our reality, right? Like, it doesn't even matter. If you can see in any way why they would think

Kevin Dennis (: 27:14

No. Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 27:20

that something you did affected their wedding. I would just say, try to mitigate it privately. That does not mean be a doormat. That does not mean like pay off every person who gets upset, but it does mean really think about it and say, could I see that maybe I could have done something differently for them? Is there anything I can offer them that would make this right? Because ultimately, even if they don't go blast you on social media, they have friends and family.

Kevin Dennis (: 27:31

No.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 27:48

you know,

like, do we really want them to tell all their friends and family like this vendor wasn't great. And so ultimately, what you want to do is try as much as possible to check for red flags. But we often don't see them. I can tell you right now if I saw red flags before a booking, I wouldn't book it. You know, I'm far enough in my career now that I'm just like, I don't need business that bad. But that's what I'm saying. So often we don't see the red flags, right? Like so often you're like, wow, you're a whole lot of crazy.

Kevin Dennis (: 27:59

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

No, but

you're so smart because I will meet with a client and I'll get off of Zoom or we'll meet with them in person and they'll leave and I'm like, nope, nope, nope, we're not, nope, they are not, they are not for us. And you gotta be able to, because you can tell and it's just in the way they're asking questions or the tone they're asking questions, it just, you and it just, you can tell it's not a good fit from the start.

Brandee Gaar (: 28:25

Yeah.

No. Nope.

Yeah.

No,

like my sales manager actually right before this call sent me a Slack and she said, we just got an email from a potential client, but they sent 78 questions they'd like us to answer before we get on a consultation. And I actually thought she was joking. I thought she was just like making up the number 78, cause it was a lot of questions. So I said, she said, I know how to answer most of them, but some of them I've like never even heard anybody ask before. And I was like, well,

Kevin Dennis (: 28:59

Holy sh- Holy shit!

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 29:14

forward it to me and I'll answer it when I get off of this podcast. And I pulled it up, like, no, it's actually 78 questions. 78 questions for a couple that's getting married two years from now, doesn't have a venue. I'm like, no, no, no. I don't care how much you're paying me. If you have 78 questions before we even get on a consult, no, no. So those are the red flags we can spot.

Kevin Dennis (: 29:27

⁓

No.

Yeah, no thank you. No, no. Yeah, and you gotta.

Yeah, yeah. So no, no, I don't think they do. do you, so this is our new normal. I'm just, so this is, we gotta be prepared. So I think the more that we can get comfortable with TikTok and get comfortable with just that world, I think we just need to be prepared.

Brandee Gaar (: 29:44

but they don't all come packaged up like that.

Yes. Yep.

Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, I have a podcast episode coming up in a couple weeks with Leah Weinberg. She's an attorney in the wedding industry. And this is actually something that she's seeing more and more and more of and her and I were talking about it. And I was like, okay, we've got to do a podcast on, know, I can certainly say here's how you need to handle it from the business owner perspective. But from a legal perspective, what are things that we need to be aware of? Is there anything we can add into our contract that

Kevin Dennis (: 30:07

Okay.

Okay.

Brandee Gaar (: 30:28

doesn't allow them to do this. I think that the jury's out on that, but I'm excited to hear more about that. Yeah, go ahead.

Kevin Dennis (: 30:35

Well, I'll give you

a little so Leah and I are both not wedding pro educators. And so we on our last monthly call, she brought up this whole thing and I'm sure you guys are going to get into it about how couples are using chat GPT to go after their wedding vendors to try to get money back. so and she said the first couple, she was just like, what's going on? And now she's like,

Brandee Gaar (: 30:41

Okay.

Yeah.

Yes!

Yes. Yep.

Kevin Dennis (: 31:03

It's just this thing. we're going through that with one of our clients right now. So literally, was like, we had this one client, everything was fine. And now all of a sudden, everything's not. And then I asked the girls after the call with Leah, I'm like, throw it in that thing that figures out if it's AI. And sure enough, it was. yes.

Brandee Gaar (: 31:10

That's so funny.

Yep. Isn't it crazy?

Yes, because they can draft these legal language. And if you don't know what's in your own contract, which let's be honest, a lot of us are kind of like, this is all legal mumbo jumbo. I don't know what it means. You feel overwhelmed by these demand letters that you get. And it's like, what is happening right now?

Kevin Dennis (: 31:37

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, so it's really, I mean, it's really everyone's beneficial to get a relationship with someone like Leah that especially someone that knows our wedding, the wedding industry, I think that's, that's what's powerful with Leah. ⁓ And then there's a gentleman, I'm blanking on his name now, but in California, there's people, you know, that specialize in the wedding and event industry, because if you go to a normal attorney, they're not, they're not going to understand the emotion that comes with some of these. Yes.

Brandee Gaar (: 31:48

Yes.

Yes.

Right, that, that's

it. I think, think, you know, Leah, Paige Griffith from the legal page is also great. But I, you know, I agree with you 100%. Like an attorney in the wedding industry gets it because there's much more behind it than just like, this person wants $2,000, you know, or this person. There's so much to it. But I will say, I think, you know, one of the key takeaways that I would say from this episode is,

Kevin Dennis (: 32:16

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 32:37

you know, it is in your best interest if at all possible within your own principles and morals and what you feel comfortable with to not let these kind of situations escalate. And that's why I say like, there are people who are going to just go after you for because they just are that type of a person. And I really probably wouldn't negotiate with that type of a person. But there are also people who have who have valid whether you believe it's right or not, but valid frustrations with something that happened at their wedding. And I would just say,

Kevin Dennis (: 32:54

Yeah.

Yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 33:07

Think about what it's worth to you to keep it from escalating because once millions of people see it and start making their own opinions, it can become something that you then have to deal with for months. so, again, I don't want to say by any means, pay off everybody. I'm just saying really be thoughtful about how much you're willing to let it escalate.

Kevin Dennis (: 33:11

Mm-hmm.

No, and that's.

Yeah, and that's kind of what we're going through with that one client right now. We found out they've got money back from the venue, the florist and other. No, so they're literally going down the train and hitting everyone. I don't know if this... I'm in California. It was a Wednesday night wedding. So they got the venue on the cheap because it was a Wednesday night. So I'm like, did they overextend themselves? In my head.

Brandee Gaar (: 33:37

You're kidding.

Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 33:57

you know, did they overextend themselves and now they're trying to get money back on their credit card to, you know, so yeah, exactly. So, yeah. So I think, yeah, I'll be really excited to listen to your talk with Leah because we're actually, run a local networking group and we have Leah coming out in July to speak to our group. she, I'm really excited to have her come out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She's going to be perfect for that. So, all right.

Brandee Gaar (: 34:02

Yeah, pay it off. Wow, Kevin, that is crazy.

Yeah, yeah, I'm excited about it.

good.

She's great and so knowledgeable, so helpful. Good. Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 34:26

As we get ready to kind of wrap up, is there a way, I mean, I don't think there is a way to prepare, but is there any way to prepare for any of this stuff that might happen to you? Like maybe having a good CRE, you know, like being ready for any of-

Brandee Gaar (: 34:41

Yeah,

I would say the best way to be ready is to one again, watch Kendra's video and I would just save it in your tic tac so that if God forbid this were to happen to you, you could at least refer back to it and be like, how did she handle it? So I would say that I would also say, ⁓ you know, know what your contract says. So I know we all think like, it doesn't matter know what your contract says, please know what your legal rights are.

Kevin Dennis (: 34:52

Hehehehehe

Brandee Gaar (: 35:10

And then I would also say, as much as none of us want to have an attorney on retainer, I don't necessarily think you need to have them on retainer, but understand who the attorneys are in our industry that understand how to litigate some of this stuff. ⁓ Know if they're licensed in your state. I think that's a really big deal too. So, because nothing is worse than you getting into a situation and you don't even know where to start. Like you don't even know who to call. And so again, it's like,

Kevin Dennis (: 35:17

Mm-mm.

Yes, that's a big, yep, 100%.

Brandee Gaar (: 35:39

It's almost like insurance. You don't necessarily need to have them on retainer, but I do think knowing who is licensed in your state, what attorneys could be helpful so that if something were to happen, it's a quick phone call to say, can I retain you? I need some help. ⁓ yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes, absolutely. So those would be my big things. And my just biggest takeaway for you guys from this whole thing is

Kevin Dennis (: 35:52

Yeah, it's just more having a relationship with them where if something happens, you can just reach out and they're going to take your call and go from there.

Brandee Gaar (: 36:07

No matter whether it's a written review or a video review, take the emotion out of it. Give yourself a minute, take the emotion out of it, step back. You will always win more favor by being factual and calm than you will ever by coming out and just saying like, this is my side. So just be not emotional, calm and collected.

Kevin Dennis (: 36:26

Yeah,

no, that, yeah, and that, and the people you could tell, because there's a local vendor in my market that will attack back. And, and, it's like, Hey, have you seen the latest? People will, you know, and then, yeah. And then, and then we all start reading the Yelp review and, and it's like, get your popcorn ready and go from there. Yeah. No, not at all. I agree. I agree.

Brandee Gaar (: 36:36

Yeah.

Wow.

⁓ no. Yeah, no, don't do that. Don't do that. You never come out

looking good about when you do that. yeah, calm collected, not emotional. Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 36:56

No, But real quick before we go, I just

thought of something else is like, okay, so we focus more on the negative, but someone leaves a positive, should we respond? Yeah, it's just like, because like, that's where I think people go wrong on the Google, the Yelps, the the knots and all that is you need to respond whether it's good or bad. Because I, yeah, yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 37:07

Yeah. Yes.

Absolutely. Yes,

because if you're only responding to the negative reviews one that kind of highlights them. If you only respond to the positive reviews, it makes you look like you kind of put your head in the sand when something goes wrong. And to be honest, you know, one of things I want to encourage you guys about is, you know, the number of times that we've created a raving fan because of a situation where either they thought we dropped the ball or we in fact did make a mistake. We have created raving fans by being able to make it right. And so, you know,

Kevin Dennis (: 37:23

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 37:47

don't be afraid. Don't be afraid of feedback or you know, come at it head on. But if somebody does leave you a positive review and you know that that has so much value as well. It doesn't typically go as viral which is sad. You know, that's just kind of how human nature is. ⁓ But I do think that you should respond to it especially if somebody leaves you a video review like if they go on tik tok and say my gosh, my wedding planner was amazing blah blah blah, that would be amazing to then

Kevin Dennis (: 38:02

No, no, no, yeah, yeah, but-

Brandee Gaar (: 38:17

either repost on your page and pin it. That's a great testimonial. Even send it out as an email, different things like that. So I almost feel like it would be an interesting concept that we haven't implemented yet. But you know, I would be interested to know if anybody has or maybe the direction we would be going is asking more of your clients to leave video reviews versus, you know, written reviews. ⁓ I think it could be an interesting

Kevin Dennis (: 38:21

Mm-hmm.

⁓ yeah. That's probably

it's probably the future because you know, Tom Chalednik from the not ⁓ he just I just recently saw him speak at a conference and he was saying that now it's like you're should be sending loom videos with with the it's like another thing to do. But they said that's because that's where the the couples that we're dealing with now, they would rather see a 15 second video of you.

Brandee Gaar (: 38:44

Right.

Yeah, yeah.

⁓ yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 39:08

than reading an email. So, no, yeah.

Brandee Gaar (: 39:11

they don't want to read an email that is absolutely for certain.

And I think, you know, even in other industries, there's a term called UGC user generated content. So it's, you know, people that have used your product and they make a video about it. A lot of them are kind of purchased bought ads at this point, but user generated content is a huge thing that people use. If you can have, you know, clients that are okay making a quick video about how much they loved working with you. And you can put that out on TikTok, put that out on Instagram pin it.

Kevin Dennis (: 39:39

Mm-hmm.

Brandee Gaar (: 39:39

⁓ That

goes way further than a written testimonial. It just does. So yeah, so that could be an interesting thing to try as well. Yeah.

Kevin Dennis (: 39:45

I agree. I agree.

Yeah, well that, mean,

it's, they always say we get older and our clients stay the same age and we got to adapt. So that maybe might be the next thing that we're adapting to as we get older. So yeah, I love it. All right, Brandee, great. I love it. And we're going to tag all the videos and everything in there. So all the clients, all the listeners can go back and hear everything and watch the videos so they understand what we were talking about. So I appreciate it. So.

Brandee Gaar (: 39:54

Yes.

That's exactly right. That's exactly right.

Yeah, and I would,

if anybody wants to hear my interview with Candra, so you can kind of hear exactly what went down from her side. we do have that on our podcast, so I can send you that link so that you can link that as well. I think people would find that interesting.

Kevin Dennis (: 40:19

Yeah.

Okay, yeah, please send us that link because I saw a little bit I saw

a little of the one of the videos you sent was a little clip of you guys as well. So I would love that as well. So alright, so how do we get in touch with you Brandee and all the things and we'll be sure to put it all in the show notes as well.

Brandee Gaar (: 40:30

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, we'll send it.

Yeah, so, how many things?

Yeah, perfect. I am at Brandee Gaar over on Instagram and our website is weddingproceo.com and our podcast is the Wedding Pro CEO podcast. So come over and listen and thank you so much for having me, Kevin. This was a lot of fun.

Kevin Dennis (: 40:53

No, was pleasure.

I enjoyed it. Thank you so much. All right, folks, we'll see you next time on another episode of Mind Your Wedding Business. Take care.